|
Best way to hide interlacing in Time Traveler?
#393687 - 04/03/22 01:43 PM
|
|
|
Obviously the original laserdisc is interlaced, which shows up quite prominently when running in MAME. What's the best way to dial this out?
I'm running MAMEUI and I'm never quite sure the various screen filters work 109% in that, so happy to switch to baseline MAME if better.
|
|
|
|
Re: Best way to hide interlacing in Time Traveler?
[Re: VirtuaIceMan]
#393688 - 04/03/22 02:21 PM
|
|
|
> I'm running MAMEUI and I'm never quite sure the various screen filters work 109% in
> that
It's the same filters and some extra ones that you don't have to use.
|
|
|
| B2K24 |
|
MAME @ 15 kHz Sony Trinitron CRT user
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 10/25/10
|
|
Posts: 2663
|
|
|
|
|
|
Send PM
|
|
|
Re: Best way to hide interlacing in Time Traveler?
[Re: VirtuaIceMan]
#393705 - 04/04/22 06:03 PM
|
|
|
Appreciate the progress without nitpicking. The real hardware is gone and you'll never see it in-person ever again in our lifetime.
I still have memories of playing the real thing in-person a quarter of a century ago in Crestwood Missouri at an Exhilarama which used to exist in Crestwood Mall.
You can still hook MAME into a CRT nowaday, but otherwise, don't criticize and ask for more. Be appreciative for what is possible.
|
|
|
|
Re: Best way to hide interlacing in Time Traveler?
[Re: B2K24]
#393709 - 04/04/22 06:34 PM
|
|
|
> Appreciate the progress without nitpicking. The real hardware is gone and you'll
> never see it in-person ever again in our lifetime.
>
> I still have memories of playing the real thing in-person a quarter of a century ago
> in Crestwood Missouri at an Exhilarama which used to exist in Crestwood Mall.
>
> You can still hook MAME into a CRT nowaday, but otherwise, don't criticize and ask
> for more. Be appreciative for what is possible.
I wouldn't call it nitpicking, it's a reasonably fair question.
I've had it at the back of my mind as to how to adapt MAME's pipeline to support pre-deinterlaced video, but after conferring with a bunch of people who were there at the time, folks who are familiar with video signal theory, as well as just generally considering the problem space, I don't think I'm going to do that.
Most advanced deinterlacers are providing a "best guess" as to what the interpolated frame would be. At the end of the day they're not tangibly different than those filters that claim to increase animation frame rate. They are, in a word, inaccurate.
The approximately 60-field-per-second refresh rate of an interlaced monitor didn't change the fact that the fields themselves were interlaced. The problem, as I see it, is that MAME seems to be showing both interlaced fields at roughly 30 frames per second, rather than showing 60 height-doubled, line-offset fields per second. That's the solution that I'm going to be aiming for.
It will most likely result in noticeable vertical jitter, but that can probably be handled with a reasonably capable post-processing shader.
|
|
|
|
Re: Best way to hide interlacing in Time Traveler?
[Re: MooglyGuy]
#393713 - 04/04/22 10:27 PM
|
|
|
First, your linked youtube video was really funny and nice to watch.
Second, it is also nice to see that you treat this interlace thing seriously. Reading your post, explains to me why you did not found a de-interlacer that operates in realtime. You searched for the "best" method to do this job. But what is with "Bob", "Blend" and "Weave" methods? They would not be exactly a "quality" choice, but they would do their job in realtime for sure.
From the discussions in the past, i fully understand why you think you are not going to do this. The precise timing that interlace needs, is a big task for sure.
I will look into Time Traveler as soon as i have enough time, to configure that in my arcade cab. The picture quality looks awesome and i am curious how it will look on a real CRT and if the interlaced fields are still intact.
> The approximately 60-field-per-second refresh rate of an interlaced monitor didn't
> change the fact that the fields themselves were interlaced. The problem, as I see it,
> is that MAME seems to be showing both interlaced fields at roughly 30 frames per
> second, rather than showing 60 height-doubled, line-offset fields per second. That's
> the solution that I'm going to be aiming for.
A good solution  nice.
|
|
|
| Dullaron |
|
Diablo III - Dunard #1884
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 07/22/05
|
|
Posts: 6125
|
|
Loc: Fort Worth, Tx
|
|
|
|
Send PM
|
|
|
|
[ATTACHED IMAGE - CLICK FOR FULL SIZE]
|
W11 Home 64-bit + Nobara OS / AMD Radeon RX 5700 XT / AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 8-Core 3.59 GHz / RAM 64 GB
|
|
| B2K24 |
|
MAME @ 15 kHz Sony Trinitron CRT user
|
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 10/25/10
|
|
Posts: 2663
|
|
|
|
|
|
Send PM
|
|
|
Re: Looks good with the bgfx on.
[Re: Dullaron]
#393720 - 04/05/22 06:13 PM
|
|
|
That is definitely not it.
My memory could be wrong. It was 25 years ago. I don't remember there being any scanlines and the video was crispy and beautiful. A completely different and unique experience than just your average CRT display at the time.
|
|
|
|
Re: Looks good with the bgfx on.
[Re: B2K24]
#393721 - 04/05/22 06:20 PM
|
|
|
It’s just a Sony TV inside the cabinet – you’ll see the aperture grille effect if you look closely enough, but no scan lines if the beam focus is adjusted properly. But the effective image size is small enough that the resolution and aperture grille aren’t that noticeable.
|
|
|
Previous 
Index 
Next 
Threaded 
Best way to hide interlacing in Time Traveler?
Reply
[Re: 
nice.
