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Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
#353826 - 05/02/16 02:13 PM
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Im having issues with 2 settings in the latest version of Mame (0.173) namely HLSL and Prescale.
For some reason whatever settings i set in the HLSL section of the Mame.ini file are being ignored and when i load a game (if i have hlsl enabled) it seems to load up its own default hlsl settings, im able to change the hlsl settings via the slider options in game (button '¬' ) and the settings are saved when i exit the game but just for that game, when i load a new game the default hlsl settings are applied again, why are my hlsl settings set in mame.ini not being read?
Next issue is with the Prescale option, this no longer appears to be working, i usually set it form the default '1' to something like '6 or 8' to give a sharper image to the display but whatever i set it to now it doesn't seem to change anything, so im not sure that its working??
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: lettuce]
#353827 - 05/02/16 02:36 PM
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: Mamesick]
#353829 - 05/02/16 02:44 PM
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Ah so i need to edit the raster.ini file with my hlsl settings then?
I hope it isnt true about prescale not working with HLSL anymore, i know it was removed from the HLSL section of the ini file but the prescale option in the same section as 'filter' option still applied the effect. To me adding prescale just gave the screen more clarity and made the whole image 'pop' more i hope they havent removed it
Edited by lettuce (05/02/16 02:44 PM)
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: lettuce]
#353830 - 05/02/16 03:07 PM
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hlsl_prescale_x/y have been removed with 0.172. You'll get the most sharp prescaled image by default without wasting performance due to a too high prescale. If you don't get a sharp image, please show me your results in a screenshot and check if your shader files in the ./hlsl folder are up-to-date.
Regarding to your mame.ini settings be aware, that these settings are only used when no other [custom].ini overrides them, e.g. the raster.ini in the ./ini/presets folder.
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: Jezze]
#353832 - 05/02/16 03:39 PM
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Ok heres a screen grab with my current hlsl settings and prescale left on the default setting....
and my hlsl raster.ini settings....
Code:
shadow_mask_tile_mode 0 shadow_mask_alpha 0.18 shadow_mask_texture shadow-mask.png shadow_mask_x_count 6 shadow_mask_y_count 4 shadow_mask_usize 0.1875 shadow_mask_vsize 0.1875 shadow_mask_uoffset 0.0 shadow_mask_voffset 0.0 distortion 0.06 cubic_distortion 0.03 distort_corner 0.15 round_corner 0.05 smooth_border 0.50 reflection 0.0 vignetting 0.30 scanline_alpha 0.60 scanline_size 1.0 scanline_height 1.4 scanline_variation 1.0 scanline_bright_scale 1.0 scanline_bright_offset 0.0 scanline_jitter 0.0 hum_bar_alpha 0.0 defocus 0.0,0.5 converge_x 0.0,0.0,0.0 converge_y 0.0,0.0,0.0 radial_converge_x 0.0,0.0,0.0 radial_converge_y 0.0,0.0,0.0 red_ratio 1.0,0.0,0.0 grn_ratio 0.0,1.0,0.0 blu_ratio 0.0,0.0,1.0 saturation 1.15 offset 0.0,0.0,0.0 scale 1.0,1.0,1.0 power 1.0,1.0,1.0 floor 0.02,0.02,0.02 phosphor_life 0.10,0.10,0.10
I know its not exactly blurry but when i was able to use prescale 6 or 8 the picture was always sharper
Edited by lettuce (05/02/16 04:04 PM)
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: lettuce]
#353834 - 05/02/16 04:21 PM
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To be honest the image looks quite sharp to me (except the JPEG-artifacts). Where exactly do you wish more "clarity"?
There is a way to render everything in a resolution twice as high as normal, which might result in more sharp image when the screen is curved.
hlsl_oversampling 1
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: Jezze]
#353837 - 05/02/16 04:29 PM
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I'll give that a try, thanks.
To be fair it could just be the Robocop game, the aspect ratio seems to be off for this game, 'standard' video mode seem to display the picture too wide and if i switch to 'pixel aspect' is seems too narrow
Im wondering if its the shadow mask that might be effecting a sharper image as well?. What is the ideal setting for...
shadow_mask_x_count shadow_mask_y_count shadow_mask_usize shadow_mask_vsize
if using a 1440p monitor?
So as it stands if using hlsl the prescale option (under OSD ACCELERATED VIDEO OPTIONS) doesn't effect anything anymore?
Edited by lettuce (05/02/16 04:34 PM)
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: lettuce]
#353844 - 05/02/16 07:46 PM
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You keep the shadow mask options the same. See http://docs.mamedev.org/advanced/hlsl.html.
You do not want HLSL to be too sharp. One of the benefits of HLSL is the nice blending of pixels you get. If you try a computer with heavy dithering, like the Sharp X1 or NEC PC-8801, you should not be able to notice (or barely notice) the dithering there.
HLSL has changed a lot. You might want to generate a new config to see how the new defaults compare to your old settings. See also docs/hlsl.txt for details on settings.
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: lettuce]
#353848 - 05/02/16 08:30 PM
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Looks already sharper than it should, also those 'scanlines' (well the dark lines, you know what I mean) should be significantly thinner and black~er.
Though if you want to keep it sharp in place of shmoothing more you could add a bit of aperture grille effect, that would be nice. And a bit more realistic too.
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> MAME isn't about playing the games anyway.
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: LensLarque]
#353855 - 05/02/16 10:14 PM
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> Looks already sharper than it should, also those 'scanlines' (well the dark lines, > you know what I mean) should be significantly thinner and black~er. > > Though if you want to keep it sharp in place of shmoothing more you could add a bit > of aperture grille effect, that would be nice. And a bit more realistic too.
Only thing with making the scanlines darker is that it then effects the whole brightness of the screen.
What settings would you suggest for aperture grille??
Also what setting do i need to be altering to get the same amount of scanlines in white/brighter areas so its the same for darker areas, at the moment with a white screen the scanlines are super thin
Edited by lettuce (05/02/16 10:15 PM)
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: lettuce]
#353857 - 05/02/16 11:33 PM
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> Ok heres a screen grab with my current hlsl settings and prescale left on the default > setting.... > > > and my hlsl raster.ini settings.... > > shadow_mask_tile_mode 0 > shadow_mask_alpha 0.18 > shadow_mask_texture shadow-mask.png > shadow_mask_x_count 6 > shadow_mask_y_count 4 > shadow_mask_usize 0.1875 > shadow_mask_vsize 0.1875 > shadow_mask_uoffset 0.0 > shadow_mask_voffset 0.0 > distortion 0.06 > cubic_distortion 0.03 > distort_corner 0.15 > round_corner 0.05 > smooth_border 0.50 > reflection 0.0 > vignetting 0.30 > scanline_alpha 0.60 > scanline_size 1.0 > scanline_height 1.4 > scanline_variation 1.0 > scanline_bright_scale 1.0 > scanline_bright_offset 0.0 > scanline_jitter 0.0 > hum_bar_alpha 0.0 > defocus 0.0,0.5 > converge_x 0.0,0.0,0.0 > converge_y 0.0,0.0,0.0 > radial_converge_x 0.0,0.0,0.0 > radial_converge_y 0.0,0.0,0.0 > red_ratio 1.0,0.0,0.0 > grn_ratio 0.0,1.0,0.0 > blu_ratio 0.0,0.0,1.0 > saturation 1.15 > offset 0.0,0.0,0.0 > scale 1.0,1.0,1.0 > power 1.0,1.0,1.0 > floor 0.02,0.02,0.02 > phosphor_life 0.10,0.10,0.10 > > I know its not exactly blurry but when i was able to use prescale 6 or 8 the picture > was always sharper
How do you get the screen curvature without the jagged edges? Mine looks "stepped". Also games like Puck Man running full screen really have thick vertical bands through it. The bands are not there when running in a window. Also, the jagged edges are much more visible. I can't capture an image in full screen mode to attach here.
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: lettuce]
#353858 - 05/02/16 11:52 PM
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> > Looks already sharper than it should, also those 'scanlines' (well the dark lines, > > you know what I mean) should be significantly thinner and black~er. > > > > Though if you want to keep it sharp in place of shmoothing more you could add a bit > > of aperture grille effect, that would be nice. And a bit more realistic too. > > Only thing with making the scanlines darker is that it then effects the whole > brightness of the screen. > > What settings would you suggest for aperture grille?? > > Also what setting do i need to be altering to get the same amount of scanlines in > white/brighter areas so its the same for darker areas, at the moment with a white > screen the scanlines are super thin
Increasing scanline darkness SHOULD darken the screen, as the effect that your doing is increasing the spacing between raster lines. This darkens the picture. E.g. when I switch my Dell monitor to VGA mode the screen gets a bit darker, and the scanlines become visible. If the screen is too dark try increasing the backlight, or reduce shadow mask darkness.
As for white and black, well scanlines should be thinner for brighter colors as the color will bleed a bit.
Here are my aperture grille settings (which I use for TV games). I do not believe any arcade monitors have aperture grilles. Aperture grille was patented by Sony and only used for their TVs and some monitor brands they licensed the technology out to. However there is no reason why you could not just plug a trinitron into an arcade cabinet, so what you are doing here is certainly possible.
# # DIRECT3D POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS # shadow_mask_tile_mode 0 shadow_mask_alpha 0.25 shadow_mask_texture aperture-grille.png shadow_mask_x_count 6 shadow_mask_y_count 6 shadow_mask_usize 0.1875 shadow_mask_vsize 0.1875 shadow_mask_uoffset 0.0 shadow_mask_voffset 0.0 distortion 0.0 cubic_distortion 0.0 distort_corner 0.0 round_corner 0.0 smooth_border 0.0 reflection 0.0 vignetting 0.0 scanline_alpha 0.50 scanline_size 1.0 scanline_height 1.0 scanline_variation 1.0 scanline_bright_scale 2.0 scanline_bright_offset 0.0 scanline_jitter 0.0 defocus 1.0,0.0 converge_x 0.0,0.0,0.0 converge_y 0.0,0.0,0.0 radial_converge_x 0.0,0.0,0.0 radial_converge_y 0.0,0.0,0.0 red_ratio 1.00,0.00,0.00 grn_ratio 0.00,1.00,0.00 blu_ratio 0.00,0.00,1.00 saturation 1.00 offset 0.00,0.00,0.00 scale 1.00,1.00,1.00 power 1.00,1.00,1.00 floor 0.00,0.00,0.00 phosphor_life 0.5,0.5,0.5
# # NTSC POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS # yiq_enable 0
# # BLOOM POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS # bloom_blend_mode 0 bloom_scale 0.25 bloom_overdrive 0.5,0.5,0.5 bloom_lvl0_weight 1.0 bloom_lvl1_weight 0.64 bloom_lvl2_weight 0.32 bloom_lvl3_weight 0.16 bloom_lvl4_weight 0.08 bloom_lvl5_weight 0.06 bloom_lvl6_weight 0.04 bloom_lvl7_weight 0.02 bloom_lvl8_weight 0.01
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Re: Prescale and HLSL settings no working as should??
[Re: anikom15]
#353864 - 05/03/16 02:54 AM
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> However there is no reason why you could not just plug a trinitron into an arcade > cabinet, so what you are doing here is certainly possible.
Oh yes consumer-grade Trinitrons are just glorious in a cab, scroll down for pics: Code:
http://neo-arcadia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=38670&start=25
Though you have to live in Europe to get one with scart RGB. They're so cheap, can even get them for free when people plan to trash theirs.
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> MAME isn't about playing the games anyway.
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