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New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
#331504 - 09/09/14 08:07 AM
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http://mamedev.org/
The fun is starting for me to see if UI source code still compiles without errors!
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: Mamesick]
#331530 - 09/09/14 06:15 PM
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what's new? Are there any nifty new optimizations that only work on a haswell proc?
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Just broke my personal record for number of consecutive days without dying!
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| R. Belmont |
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Cuckoo for IGAvania
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: URherenow]
#331531 - 09/09/14 06:34 PM
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> what's new? Are there any nifty new optimizations that only work on a haswell proc?
No, but the compiler's new enough to have heard of Haswell (and Ivy Bridge, actually - the last compiler was pretty old) this time. It's apparently also more stable on XP for those 10 or 12 people that won't get with the program ;-)
Mostly this is about getting everything up to recent so e.g. SDL-for-Windows builds and QMC2 can switch to SDL2, and also as prep for the universal renderer work we're looking to do.
Edited by R. Belmont (09/09/14 06:35 PM)
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| Dullaron |
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Mitchell or Dunard Garaus
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Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Mamesick]
#331556 - 09/10/14 08:43 AM
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I even had the newer files replace the older files. Files can be found in the mingw-mame-w64-20140905.exe.
I was using the SDL_LIBVER = sdl2 in the sdl.mak.
QtCore4.dll
QtGui4.dll
SDL.dll
SDL2.dll
waitvsync < Leave this off. Speed issue when this is on. Speed is at 96-100% when off.
syncrefresh < Leave this off. Speed issue when this is on. Speed is at 96-100% when off.
Code:
K:\SDLUME>sdlmame64 svc
Average speed: 50.69% (10 seconds)
K:\SDLUME>pause
Press any key to continue . . .
Stick with the default settings. Don't even enabled the sdl2 in the sdl.mak file. Probably unstable at this time. I went back to the default setup. Talking about the sdlmame64 and sdlmess64.
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
sdl + waitvsync 1 + syncrefresh 1 = Is fine on the speed. (Default settings.)
sdl2 + waitvsync 1 + syncrefresh 1 = Speed drop.
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W11 Home 64-bit + Nobara OS / AMD Radeon RX 5700 XT / AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 8-Core 3.59 GHz / RAM 64 GB
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Dullaron]
#331557 - 09/10/14 09:31 AM
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What I noticed instead is that the 64-bit executable is 10 MB smaller in size if compared with one compiled with old tools. Is it normal? 32-bit build is not affected. MAME command-line, no modifications or UI code.
Edited by Mamesick (09/10/14 09:41 AM)
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Mamesick]
#331563 - 09/10/14 03:43 PM
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Weird here but trying a clean compile with the last SVN repo and new tools gimme an error:
Generating H8-300 source file...
process_begin: CreateProcess(NULL, python src/emu/cpu/h8/h8make.py src/emu/cpu/h
8/h8.lst o obj/windows/emu/cpu/h8/h8.inc, ...) failed.
make (e=2): O sistema nŇo pode encontrar o arquivo especificado.
src/emu/cpu/cpu.mak:650: recipe for target 'obj/windows/emu/cpu/h8/h8.inc' faile
d
make: *** [obj/windows/emu/cpu/h8/h8.inc] Error 2
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| B2K24 |
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MAME @ 15 kHz Sony Trinitron CRT user
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Ashura-X]
#331566 - 09/10/14 04:10 PM
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I'm guessing it's because python is not in your path.
There's an example path on the download page of the new tools.
Quote:
set path=mingw\mingw64-w32\bin;mingw\mingw64-w32\opt\bin;mingw\mingw64-w32\Qt\bin; (32-bit)
set path=mingw\mingw64-w64\bin;mingw\mingw64-w64\opt\bin;mingw\mingw64-w64\Qt\bin; (64-bit)
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| R. Belmont |
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Mamesick]
#331567 - 09/10/14 04:46 PM
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> What I noticed instead is that the 64-bit executable is 10 MB smaller in size if
> compared with one compiled with old tools. Is it normal?
Executable size swings on a different compiler are normal, yes.
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: B2K24]
#331569 - 09/10/14 05:58 PM
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Thx a lot for the explanation my friend 
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| Big Karnak |
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Mamesick]
#331580 - 09/11/14 03:33 AM
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Quote:
32-bit build is not affected. MAME command-line, no modifications or UI code.
Phewww, glad to hear this.
Quote:
It's apparently also more stable on XP for those 10 or 12 people that won't get with the program ;-)
More than a quarter PC users still use Windows XP. That's millions and millions of people. That's more than 1 out of 4 people. So if MAME were to stop being supported on Win XP 32-bit, it could possibly isolate and lose more than a quarter of it's users. That's bad business.
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| redk9258 |
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Big Karnak]
#331582 - 09/11/14 04:18 AM
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> More than a quarter PC users still use Windows XP. That's millions and millions of
> people. That's more than 1 out of 4 people. So if MAME were to stop being supported
> on Win XP 32-bit, it could possibly isolate and lose more than a quarter of it's
> users. That's bad business.
No, most people into MAME are running 64-bit Windows 7.
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| Big Karnak |
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: redk9258]
#331583 - 09/11/14 04:25 AM
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Quote:
No, most people into MAME are running 64-bit Windows 7.
I never said most weren't. I'm saying there is a large minority of people that still use Win XP 32-bit. More than 25% of PC users are still running Win XP. That's more than 1 out of 4 people. That is a whole lot of people. (That does not mean most people though, of course.)
Btw, I'll be getting a new PC before the end of the year, but even then, I'd still like to see MAME supported on Win XP 32-bit operating systems because I know that there are many people that still use that OS.
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Big Karnak]
#331585 - 09/11/14 04:33 AM
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> I never said most weren't. I'm saying there is a large minority of people that still
> use Win XP 32-bit. More than 25% of PC users are still running Win XP. That's more
> than 1 out of 4 people. That is a whole lot of people. (That does not mean most
> people though, of course.)
A lot of the machines running XP are in business environments where there's some piece of legacy software that requires XP, or they're "appliance" computers like ATMs and point of sale terminals. The proportion of MAME's target audience running Windows XP is a lot lower than that.
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I keep on testing.. testing.. testing... into the future!
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Vas Crabb]
#331586 - 09/11/14 04:43 AM
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> > I never said most weren't. I'm saying there is a large minority of people that
> still
> > use Win XP 32-bit. More than 25% of PC users are still running Win XP. That's more
> > than 1 out of 4 people. That is a whole lot of people. (That does not mean most
> > people though, of course.)
>
> A lot of the machines running XP are in business environments where there's some
> piece of legacy software that requires XP, or they're "appliance" computers like ATMs
> and point of sale terminals. The proportion of MAME's target audience running Windows
> XP is a lot lower than that.
Last 500 visitors to my website which hosts a front-end for MAME shows:
Quote:
Operating System Stats
Win7
51.8%
259 Hits
Win8.1
18.4%
92 Hits
WinXP
9.8%
49 Hits
Just some data to ponder..
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| Big Karnak |
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Tafoid]
#331587 - 09/11/14 05:08 AM
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25%, 10%... still significant number. As long as it doesn't interfere with MAME's progress, I'd never want to rip the joystick out of someone's hands and the joy and happiness that goes along with it.... whether it be 25% or 10%.
Tafoid, how come you still consider your emulator to be in a BETA stage after all these years and releases?... JC
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Big Karnak]
#331589 - 09/11/14 05:47 AM
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> 25%, 10%... still significant number. As long as it doesn't interfere with MAME's
> progress, I'd never want to rip the joystick out of someone's hands and the joy and
> happiness that goes along with it.... whether it be 25% or 10%.
XP will never get new DirectX. Being limited to using ancient DirectX will become problematic eventually. XP users at this point are consciously opting out of progress with their OS, so they shouldn't be too worried about missing out on progress in other areas.
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MAME is not, and never will be a "business" (nt)
[Re: Big Karnak]
#331592 - 09/11/14 06:28 AM
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Just broke my personal record for number of consecutive days without dying!
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: redk9258]
#331595 - 09/11/14 07:22 AM
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> No, most people into MAME are running 64-bit Windows 7.
There's a sizable group of people running Windows XP Professional x64 Edition because it's the best option at the moment for running GroovyMAME on a real arcade monitor.
Windows 7 has some issues and limitations that are still being worked around when it comes to using an arcade monitor.
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GroovyMAME support forum on BYOAC
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: R. Belmont]
#331601 - 09/11/14 10:09 AM
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Will moving to SDL2 on Windows help with audio latency or input lag?
I really like SDLMAME's video output with that ex-Nvidia guy's shader, but the audio latency is noticeably higher than Windows MAME, and the inputs feel less responsive.
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| Tafoid |
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I keep on testing.. testing.. testing... into the future!
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Big Karnak]
#331602 - 09/11/14 10:19 AM
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> Tafoid, how come you still consider your emulator to be in a BETA stage after all
> these years and releases?... JC
My "Front-End" never progressed to a level which I was happy with. My original MAMELOAD back in the early DOS days of MAME was easily a Top 5 popular Front-End, but that never translated over to Windows when I resurrected it years later attempting to retain the same simplistic visual style and adding all sorts of enhancements over my previous installment. I still plan to use it for my cabinet should I ever get to make it.
Anyway, I keep it up as a few people do find it useful and I do what I can to keep them supported. Ironically, I find myself rarely using it and 99.9% of the time I'm using the command-line for everything I do.
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| Big Karnak |
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Re: MAME is not, and never will be a "business" (nt)
[Re: URherenow]
#331607 - 09/11/14 03:20 PM
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Quote:
MAME is not, and never will be a "business"
That was a figure of speech.
Example:
- "Pissing people off is bad business."
- "Hey, hey!... pissing people off is not a business!"
- "I know ya big dope, it was a figure of speech."
     
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| R. Belmont |
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Cuckoo for IGAvania
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Big Karnak]
#331611 - 09/11/14 05:19 PM
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> 25%, 10%... still significant number. As long as it doesn't interfere with MAME's
> progress, I'd never want to rip the joystick out of someone's hands and the joy and
> happiness that goes along with it.... whether it be 25% or 10%.
That wouldn't actually happen. All the versions of MAME released up until the point where we cut off XP would continue to work. And according to people on this very forum, as long as that's after 0.155 "MAME's work is completed" with Raiden II, so ;-)
More seriously, full enjoyment of MAME since 0.106 has been predicated on having recent hardware and (post-2007) a 64-bit operating system. We support backwards as long as it's practical (0.154 is still supported on OS/2!) but at some point practicality makes some cold decisions.
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| R. Belmont |
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: bigbluefe]
#331612 - 09/11/14 05:26 PM
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> Will moving to SDL2 on Windows help with audio latency or input lag?
>
> I really like SDLMAME's video output with that ex-Nvidia guy's shader, but the audio
> latency is noticeably higher than Windows MAME, and the inputs feel less responsive.
SDL2 on Windows uses XAudio2 on Win7/8/9 so it should be possible to get lower audio latency than baseline. I just need to retune the MAME-side code to let it take advantage.
It also uses XInput on available Windows versions which should help with input lag and controller compatibility.
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: Vas Crabb]
#331614 - 09/11/14 07:13 PM
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Yeap we still use winXp here at work. our main reason is the cost to replace the software we use. boss doesn't want to buy a bunch of new programs to update.
you know how it goes.. if it aint broke don't fix it. besides the accounting program
we use would have to be updated and I believe its up around 800 bucks just for that..
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Only here to annoy...
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Re: MAME is not, and never will be a "business" (nt)
[Re: Big Karnak]
#331616 - 09/11/14 08:44 PM
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The attitude of public mamedevs has pretty much always been that user numbers don't matter, and in fact it would probably be better if it was lower. They don't gain anything by having more people use mame. There will never be a shortage of bugs at mametesters.
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: krick]
#331622 - 09/11/14 09:42 PM
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> There's a sizable group of people running Windows XP Professional x64 Edition because it's the best option at the moment for running GroovyMAME on a real arcade monitor.
Windows 7 has some issues and limitations that are still being worked around when it comes to using an arcade monitor.
I forget about this. Having been spoiled with the ease of function of AdvanceMAME, and elsewise using HLSL on my arcade multisync, I haven't bothered thinking about GroovyMAME in an age. I can't think of a reason to use GroovyMAME on a CGA monitor......
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: R. Belmont]
#331623 - 09/11/14 09:44 PM
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> More seriously, full enjoyment of MAME since 0.106 has been predicated on having recent hardware and (post-2007) a 64-bit operating system. We support backwards as long as it's practical (0.154 is still supported on OS/2!) but at some point practicality makes some cold decisions.
I can't see using XP on a machine newer than, say, '08. Fuck. (( I know, I've converted....but not so much as am exemplifying Arby's sentiment above. ))
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: R. Belmont]
#331645 - 09/12/14 04:12 AM
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> > Will moving to SDL2 on Windows help with audio latency or input lag?
> >
> > I really like SDLMAME's video output with that ex-Nvidia guy's shader, but the
> audio
> > latency is noticeably higher than Windows MAME, and the inputs feel less
> responsive.
>
> SDL2 on Windows uses XAudio2 on Win7/8/9 so it should be possible to get lower audio
> latency than baseline. I just need to retune the MAME-side code to let it take
> advantage.
>
> It also uses XInput on available Windows versions which should help with input lag
> and controller compatibility.
That sounds pretty good. I thought that raw input had lower latency than XInput for keyboard-based input, though. I'm thinking I-PAC.
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| Quantum Leaper |
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OCRer and Monkey Typist for Galaxy Game
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Re: Pointing out there is a big speed drop when using these settings.
[Re: krick]
#331663 - 09/12/14 09:42 AM
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> > No, most people into MAME are running 64-bit Windows 7.
>
> There's a sizable group of people running Windows XP Professional x64 Edition because
> it's the best option at the moment for running GroovyMAME on a real arcade monitor.
>
Last time I tried WinXp x64 edition, it would crash more than Windows 3.11 did, a decade before that. Window 3.11 would crash about a couple times a day, and Windows XP Pro x64 would crash about every few hours or so. At least I didn't pay that much for it, I got it though a Student discount.
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: R. Belmont]
#331672 - 09/12/14 05:13 PM
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I'm getting this error with the latest compilation tools when trying to compile SDLMAME for Windows (32 or 64). Any ideas?
This is my path:
D:\msvn>path=d:\mingw\mingw64-w64\bin;d:\mingw\mingw64-w64\opt\bin;d:\mingw\ming
w64-w64\qt\bin
Compiling src/osd/modules/debugger/qt/debugqtwindow.c...
src/osd/modules/sound/direct_sound.c: In member function 'HRESULT sound_direct_s
ound::dsound_init()':
src/osd/modules/sound/direct_sound.c:251:39: error: 'struct sdl_window_info' has
no member named 'sdl_window'
SDL_GetWindowWMInfo(sdl_window_list->sdl_window, &wminfo);
^
src/osd/modules/sound/direct_sound.c:251:58: error: 'SDL_GetWindowWMInfo' was no
t declared in this scope
SDL_GetWindowWMInfo(sdl_window_list->sdl_window, &wminfo);
^
In file included from src/osd/modules/sound/direct_sound.c:16:0:
src/osd/modules/sound/direct_sound.c:252:59: error: 'SDL_SysWMinfo' has no membe
r named 'info'
result = IDirectSound_SetCooperativeLevel(dsound, wminfo.info.win.window, DSSC
L_PRIORITY);
^
make: *** [obj/sdl/osd/modules/sound/direct_sound.o] Error 1
make: *** Waiting for unfinished jobs....
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| R. Belmont |
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Cuckoo for IGAvania
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: bigbluefe]
#331675 - 09/12/14 08:12 PM
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> I'm getting this error with the latest compilation tools when trying to compile
> SDLMAME for Windows (32 or 64). Any ideas?
I added the option to use -sound dsound on SDL Windows builds but bedtime hit before I could make it work on SDL 1.2. So current source will only build for SDL2 on Windows.
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: Mamesick]
#331679 - 09/12/14 09:00 PM
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I wouldn't put much stock in web browser usage to prove what OS folks are using for MAME. I use Linux and/or Windows 7 x64 to download my software, and then I transfer it to a MAME cabinet running Windows XP.
Tried to make a Linux cab first - didn't care for the most of the available frontends, couldn't get GroovyArcade to function with my video card. I couldn't completely "hide" Win7 the same way I can with XP, so XP it stays.
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| R. Belmont |
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Cuckoo for IGAvania
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: snarfies]
#331681 - 09/12/14 10:29 PM
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> I wouldn't put much stock in web browser usage to prove what OS folks are using for
> MAME. I use Linux and/or Windows 7 x64 to download my software, and then I transfer
> it to a MAME cabinet running Windows XP.
Be that as it may, we're very much into the sunset for XP and it really shouldn't be used for new cabinets. The gumball machine may stop dispensing at any time for that OS - it'll probably get 0.155 and Raiden II, but anything beyond that is unpredictable.
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: R. Belmont]
#331682 - 09/12/14 11:12 PM
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> Be that as it may, we're very much into the sunset for XP and it really shouldn't be
> used for new cabinets. The gumball machine may stop dispensing at any time for that
> OS - it'll probably get 0.155 and Raiden II, but anything beyond that is
> unpredictable.
Oh noo!!! Dont break my heart R.B. ! It means i will have to update my mame cab hardware ! 
J/kin. But the cab update part is true. Lol
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Only here to annoy...
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: R. Belmont]
#331687 - 09/13/14 02:27 AM
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> > I'm getting this error with the latest compilation tools when trying to compile
> > SDLMAME for Windows (32 or 64). Any ideas?
>
> I added the option to use -sound dsound on SDL Windows builds but bedtime hit before
> I could make it work on SDL 1.2. So current source will only build for SDL2 on
> Windows.
I enabled SDL2, and it builds successfully now. Thanks a lot!
I think I might be an SDL convert. With dsound, it seems like there's less audio latency, but there's still a hair more than I'm getting in the Windows MAME. The video output in SDLMAME is just phenomenal, though. Thanks again.
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| B2K24 |
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MAME @ 15 kHz Sony Trinitron CRT user
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: bigbluefe]
#331688 - 09/13/14 02:46 AM
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I can build window MAME with the newest tools easily, but hit errors when trying to roll my own SDL builds.
I'm unsure if I need anything additional besides the mingw-mame tools and 64 bit sdl.dll in my path.
http://pastebin.com/zaGzr31N
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| B2K24 |
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MAME @ 15 kHz Sony Trinitron CRT user
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Reged: 10/25/10
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: B2K24]
#331724 - 09/13/14 08:01 PM
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OK I had to run the setup-Qt.bat and everything compiled just fine 
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| Big Karnak |
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Part-time Lurker
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: R. Belmont]
#331745 - 09/14/14 05:26 AM
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Quote:
Be that as it may, we're very much into the sunset for XP and it really shouldn't be used for new cabinets. The gumball machine may stop dispensing at any time for that OS - it'll probably get 0.155 and Raiden II, but anything beyond that is unpredictable.
You want war?!?  http://youtu.be/a-C4Uhdghr8?t=2h4m59s
If/when that does happen... will it still be possible for users to compile their own unofficial Win XP 32-bit builds? Or will it be impossible?
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: Big Karnak]
#331746 - 09/14/14 05:30 AM
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MAME is open source. Of course it's possible. You just need to know how to code... and have enough time on your hands.
When it's no longer supported, it's because maintaining compatibility is no longer worth the time(to the MAMEDevs).
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: snarfies]
#331752 - 09/14/14 10:07 AM
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I see no reason why you couldn't use Linux to run MAME going forward even if the hardware isn't going to work with Windows 7. Unless whatever hardware wont work with Windows 7 also happens to be one of the rare pieces of hardware that Linux cant use either.
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: URherenow]
#331761 - 09/14/14 08:06 PM
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> When it's no longer supported, it's because maintaining compatibility is no longer worth the time(to the MAMEDevs).
And, arguably, no longer worth doing for anyone else. Might as well go back and use .37 .
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| R. Belmont |
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Cuckoo for IGAvania
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: Big Karnak]
#331764 - 09/14/14 08:54 PM
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> If/when that does happen... will it still be possible for users to compile their own
> unofficial Win XP 32-bit builds? Or will it be impossible?
I expect when XP is killed it will be in favor of all the lovely new technologies Microsoft has introduced since 2001 in which case no, it will not be possible at all.
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Re: New Compile Tools at mamedev.org released
[Re: R. Belmont]
#332165 - 09/22/14 04:25 PM
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> I expect when XP is killed it will be in favor of all the lovely new technologies
> Microsoft has introduced since 2001 in which case no, it will not be possible at all.
When this happens then theoretically someone could create an osd that is compatible with XP. Although how much work it is and whether anyone does it is another matter.
Edited by smf (09/22/14 04:25 PM)
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