| AWJ |
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Reged: 03/08/05
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Programmers: Is this true?
#285022 - 05/05/12 12:00 PM
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Quote:
Imagine you have uh, a toolbox. A set of tools. Looks okay, standard stuff in there.
You pull out a screwdriver, and you see it’s one of those weird tri-headed things. Okay, well, that’s not very useful to you, but you guess it comes in handy sometimes.
You pull out the hammer, but to your dismay, it has the claw part on both sides. Still serviceable though, I mean, you can hit nails with the middle of the head holding it sideways.
You pull out the pliers, but they don’t have those serrated surfaces; it’s flat and smooth. That’s less useful, but it still turns bolts well enough, so whatever.
And on you go. Everything in the box is kind of weird and quirky, but maybe not enough to make it completely worthless. And there’s no clear problem with the set as a whole; it still has all the tools.
Now imagine you meet millions of carpenters using this toolbox who tell you “well hey what’s the problem with these tools? They’re all I’ve ever used and they work fine!” And the carpenters show you the houses they’ve built, where every room is a pentagon and the roof is upside-down. And you knock on the front door and it just collapses inwards and they all yell at you for breaking their door.
That’s what’s wrong with PHP.
I've never used PHP...
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Re: Programmers: Is this true?
[Re: AWJ]
#285026 - 05/05/12 12:20 PM
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The problem with PHP is that the barriers to entry are very low, so it attracts bad developers. It's possible to write very nice PHP applications. It's very easy to write bloody awful PHP applications. It's possible to write bad code in any language, but a language with higher barriers to entry doesn't tend to attract the same bottom of the barrel developers. They're looking for something easy to get into. Yes, the language and library are quirky in places, and some things work differently to similar features in other languages. But on the whole, the biggest problem with PHP is the number of shit developers working with it. The language and library aren't as bad as people like to say.
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| Pi |
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Allergic to life
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Reged: 09/20/03
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Loc: Room 101
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I agree
[Re: Vas Crabb]
#285027 - 05/05/12 12:44 PM
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PHP is nice to work with but it's also very permissive so you can write bad code easily. But the tools comparison is very far-fetched. It has some rough corners but overall it's a pretty complete package. With some discipline you can write great code, but that tells more about how good coder you are than how good the coding language is. Mr. Do can testify.
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Wound up, can't sleep, can't do anything right, little honey / Oh, since I set my eyes on you. / I tell you the truth.
I can't get it right / Get it right / Since I met you...
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italie |
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MAME owes italie many thank yous, hah
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Third'ed
[Re: Pi]
#285035 - 05/05/12 02:59 PM
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> PHP is nice to work with but it's also very permissive so you can write bad code
> easily. But the tools comparison is very far-fetched. It has some rough corners but
> overall it's a pretty complete package. With some discipline you can write great
> code, but that tells more about how good coder you are than how good the coding
> language is. Mr. Do can testify.
A more proper analogy would be a toolbox filled with Harbor Freight Tools (Cheap Chinese Clone Tools). In experienced hands you can build a decent house with them. You'll just see a lot more crappy houses built with these tools, because they're cheap and inexperienced carpenters don't have to spend a fortune to get started.
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I wouldn't even use a tool analogy, then....
[Re: italie]
#285119 - 05/06/12 04:06 AM
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Maybe not use an analogy at all. Vas Crab and Pi summed it up pretty shortly.
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Consider it high comedy....sincere tragedy....whatever...don't take it personally.
The Culture
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| italie |
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MAME owes italie many thank yous, hah
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Re: I wouldn't even use a tool analogy, then....
[Re: mogli]
#285123 - 05/06/12 05:07 AM
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> Maybe not use an analogy at all. Vas Crab and Pi summed it up pretty shortly.
The original question specifically referenced an analogy. I adjusted the analogy accordingly.
Maybe you should adjust your brain to just use my analogy.
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Re: I wouldn't even use a tool analogy, then....
[Re: italie]
#285155 - 05/06/12 01:43 PM
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> > Maybe not use an analogy at all. Vas Crab and Pi summed it up pretty shortly.
>
> The original question specifically referenced an analogy. I adjusted the analogy
> accordingly.
>
> Maybe you should adjust your brain to just use my analogy.
That's the kind of thinking that has people use crap like PHP. 
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| italie |
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MAME owes italie many thank yous, hah
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Re: I wouldn't even use a tool analogy, then....
[Re: TriggerFin]
#285157 - 05/06/12 02:20 PM
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> > > Maybe not use an analogy at all. Vas Crab and Pi summed it up pretty shortly.
> >
> > The original question specifically referenced an analogy. I adjusted the analogy
> > accordingly.
> >
> > Maybe you should adjust your brain to just use my analogy.
>
> That's the kind of thinking that has people use crap like PHP.
Then I must be on the right track...
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Re: I wouldn't even use a tool analogy, then....
[Re: italie]
#285218 - 05/06/12 11:52 PM
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> > > > Maybe not use an analogy at all. Vas Crab and Pi summed it up pretty shortly.
> Then I must be on the right track...
No, baby, you have to set dem a nue track. Which is what I was saying V and P did.
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Consider it high comedy....sincere tragedy....whatever...don't take it personally.
The Culture
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| Bekki Doll |
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A cynical yet secular shiny retrogamer, thread ressurector and fan of the word "gay".
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Re: I wouldn't even use a tool analogy, then....
[Re: mogli]
#285224 - 05/07/12 12:12 AM
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Quote:
No, baby, you have to set dem a nue track. Which is what I was saying V and P did.
I can't help but think of FreeBASIC: It's very powerful, especially for quick'n'dirty programs. But it's entirely possible to write very poor code with it as well.
I'm a stickler for creating efficient code yet having a nicely formatted source code listing with lots of remarks and functional documentation. I'm sure that people who've dealt with BASIC (especially BASICA/GWBASIC) have seen very poor spaghetti code that may get the job done but it's just an outright pain to debug and adapt when improvements are needed.
--Bekki
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Combating functional illiteracy with latex-clad drama since the '80s, because old video games rule!
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