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Tetris Mason
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This should start a nice discussion Part Duex
#261897 - 08/10/11 05:35 PM
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Franklin Roosevelt (D) introduced the Social Security (FICA) Program. He promised:
1. That participation in the Program would be voluntary.
No longer Voluntary
2. That the participants would only have to pay 1% of the first $1,400 of their annual incomes into the program.
Now 7.65% on the first $90,000
3. That the money the participants elected to put into the program would be tax deductible.
No longer tax deductible after the Clinton administration, with Al Gore casting the 'tie-breaking' deciding vote as President of the Senate.
4. That the money would go to an independent 'Trust Fund' rather than into the general operating fund, and therefore, would only be used to fund the Social Security Retirement Program.
Under Johnson (D) and a party-monopoly of both chambers the money was moved to the general fund and spent.
5. That the annuity payments to the retirees would never be taxed as income.
Under Clinton & Gore now 85% of your Social Security is subject to taxes.
6. Only those who contributed would be eligle to benefit.
Under Jimmy Carter (D), elderly immigrants who never paid into the system are now eligible for annuity payments.
Government has a terrible track record with our money and managing our entitlements, yet we keep naively thinking this time will be different. We can't control future congresses, so is't it better to close (and never open) pandoras box of taxes. Yes, some people will mismanage their futures and their money, but that they do unto themselves... why institutionalize mismanagement so that it applies to everyone?
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Giver of truth.
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Re: This should start a nice discussion Part Duex
[Re: GatKong]
#261908 - 08/10/11 06:52 PM
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> Franklin Roosevelt (D) introduced the Social Security (FICA) Program. He promised:
>
> 1. That participation in the Program would be voluntary.
>
> No longer Voluntary
>
> 2. That the participants would only have to pay 1% of the first $1,400 of their
> annual incomes into the program.
>
> Now 7.65% on the first $90,000
>
> 3. That the money the participants elected to put into the program would be tax
> deductible.
>
> No longer tax deductible after the Clinton administration, with Al Gore casting the
> 'tie-breaking' deciding vote as President of the Senate.
>
> 4. That the money would go to an independent 'Trust Fund' rather than into the
> general operating fund, and therefore, would only be used to fund the Social Security
> Retirement Program.
>
> Under Johnson (D) and a party-monopoly of both chambers the money was moved to the
> general fund and spent.
>
> 5. That the annuity payments to the retirees would never be taxed as income.
>
> Under Clinton & Gore now 85% of your Social Security is subject to taxes.
>
> 6. Only those who contributed would be eligle to benefit.
>
> Under Jimmy Carter (D), elderly immigrants who never paid into the system are now
> eligible for annuity payments.
>
>
> Government has a terrible track record with our money and managing our entitlements,
> yet we keep naively thinking this time will be different. We can't control future
> congresses, so is't it better to close (and never open) pandoras box of taxes. Yes,
> some people will mismanage their futures and their money, but that they do unto
> themselves... why institutionalize mismanagement so that it applies to everyone?
Also:
7. Under Dwight Eisenhower (R), the tax rate was raised to 4.0% (2.0% for the employer, 2.0% for the employee) and disability benefits were added.
8. Under Richard Nixon (R), there was a 20% increase in benefits for 27.8 million Americans.
9. President George W. Bush (R), pushed for a partial privatization of the Social Security system so contributors could invest their contributions in the stock market. No specific mention was made of any changes that would allow everyone to just buy silver with all of their contributions.
When Social Security was started, the average life expectancy was 64 years old and benefits would start paying at 65 years old. Now, life expectancy is nearly 79 years old. Perhaps if we eliminate Medicare, the whole thing will sort of just sort itself out. Otherwise, I think any changes we make should apply to those who had not yet reached the age of 35 in 2011.
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Reformed Sk3n3 Quitter
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Re: This should start a nice discussion Part Duex
[Re: GatKong]
#261919 - 08/10/11 09:57 PM
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Sounds, to me, like it's not a problem with Social Security in itself (although the whole ageing society pyramid scheme thang doesn't help, admittedly) but rather with the government's ability to balance its books and not penny pinch from various pots over the years
What the government needs is more sources of income - I heard a story the other day about bonuses given to bankers of the high street bank Lloyds TSB/RBS, which pointed out that the 'taxpayer owns 40%' of it
This ownership came about because the government bailed then out when they were about to go to the wall, but it occurred to me, in the long run, that it might just be an act of financial genius - We, in this country, know from past experience that nationalising stuff REALLY doesn't work but maybe owning a non-controlling share of competitive companies that are bound to make a profit in the long run - like banks - its what governments should be doing - profits funding government services definitely beats funding 'fat cats' lifestyles!
> Franklin Roosevelt (D) introduced the Social Security (FICA) Program. He promised:
>
> 1. That participation in the Program would be voluntary.
>
> No longer Voluntary
>
> 2. That the participants would only have to pay 1% of the first $1,400 of their
> annual incomes into the program.
>
> Now 7.65% on the first $90,000
>
> 3. That the money the participants elected to put into the program would be tax
> deductible.
>
> No longer tax deductible after the Clinton administration, with Al Gore casting the
> 'tie-breaking' deciding vote as President of the Senate.
>
> 4. That the money would go to an independent 'Trust Fund' rather than into the
> general operating fund, and therefore, would only be used to fund the Social Security
> Retirement Program.
>
> Under Johnson (D) and a party-monopoly of both chambers the money was moved to the
> general fund and spent.
>
> 5. That the annuity payments to the retirees would never be taxed as income.
>
> Under Clinton & Gore now 85% of your Social Security is subject to taxes.
>
> 6. Only those who contributed would be eligle to benefit.
>
> Under Jimmy Carter (D), elderly immigrants who never paid into the system are now
> eligible for annuity payments.
>
>
> Government has a terrible track record with our money and managing our entitlements,
> yet we keep naively thinking this time will be different. We can't control future
> congresses, so is't it better to close (and never open) pandoras box of taxes. Yes,
> some people will mismanage their futures and their money, but that they do unto
> themselves... why institutionalize mismanagement so that it applies to everyone?
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