| John IV |
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IV/Play, MAME, MAMEUI
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Reged: 09/22/03
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Posts: 1970
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Loc: Washington, USA
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FWIW, MAME slower on Win 11 vs Win 10 on my system.
#392616 - 11/17/21 05:46 AM
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So as many know for benching I have an i7-6700K on an Asus Sabertooth z170 m.2. I built this in 2016 and overloaded it at the time to futureproof it as far as I could. So far it's been doing fine at 4.5Ghz providing bench runs every release.
Enter Windows 11. The floor for Win11 is TPM1.2 security and my generation 6 i7 is not included. The last BIOS for my mobo won't let me turn on the chip's TPM to overcome that. I got an actual physical TPM2 chip to add to the motherboard header and that took care of that requirement. Well MSFT allows you to install from ISO or bootable thumbdrive and do a clean install and bypass the CPU generational check which I did.
So I'm running Windows 11 x64 on the 4.5Ghz 6700K. Aside from design annoyances it's been 'fair'. Anyhow, from the last few bench runs on nightly builds I'm seeing upwards of a 5-10% dip in MAME.
Maybe the unsupported nature of the 6700K, I don't know. But there it is.
That said, I will likely be heading to Alder Lake 12700K when the supply chain settles down and some Corsair DDR5 shows up. Maybe over the Christmas break.
Code:
Game 10/27/2021 11/14/2021 Δ
blitz 300 314 5%
crusnusa 331 312 -6%
cubeqst 319 355 11%
cyvern 1229 1003 -18%
dkong 4471 4385 -2%
drivedge 371 358 -4%
gauntleg 638 634 -1%
gnbarich 1874 1705 -9%
gradius 4441 438 -1%
gtfore06 216 214 -1%
harddriv 684 680 -1%
kidniki 471 471 0%
kof98 1350 1122 -17%
mario 1140 1076 -6%
mk4 288 279 -3%
pacman 12565 12724 1%
pinkswts 1849 1585 -14%
pongf 551 545 -1%
propcycl 274 270 -1%
radikalb 259 246 -5%
roadblst 1097 1102 0%
robotron 6072 6008 -1%
rvschool 341 356 4%
scud 91 86 -5%
sf2 2284 2212 -3%
sfa2 1868 1840 -1%
sfiii 1368 1278 -7%
slrasslt 495 497 1%
spacfury 180 185 3%
starblad 201 188 -6%
starsldr 63 66 4%
sushibar 88 87 0%
tekken 591 547 -7%
tekken3 258 251 -3%
vf2 180 176 -2%
vfkids 141 129 -9%
Scores 1248 1215 -3%
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john iv
http://www.mameui.info/
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Re: FWIW, MAME slower on Win 11 vs Win 10 on my system.
[Re: John IV]
#392617 - 11/17/21 10:02 AM
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> So as many know for benching I have an i7-6700K on an Asus Sabertooth z170 m.2. I
> built this in 2016 and overloaded it at the time to futureproof it as far as I could.
> So far it's been doing fine at 4.5Ghz providing bench runs every release.
>
> Enter Windows 11.
I have heaps of computers of varying ages, the newest not even a year old - and not one of them is suitable for Windows 11. I don't see the point of buying yet another computer for an inferior OS, so I'll wait for Windows 12. Perhaps Microsoft might see sense and relax the idiotic restrictions. And maybe pigs might fly.
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Re: FWIW, MAME slower on Win 11 vs Win 10 on my system.
[Re: John IV]
#392621 - 11/17/21 04:50 PM
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Quote:
That said, I will likely be heading to Alder Lake 12700K when the supply chain
settles down and some Corsair DDR5 shows up. Maybe over the Christmas break.
That would be cool to see the benchmarks for a 12700K (or any Alder Lake) with MAME.
These things have a good 40-50% single thread IPC increase over my 9900K!
..that would be getting very close to 60FPS, in some of the most demanding, hold out games left in MAME.
Still won't quite be enough for Atomiswave stuff to hold 60fps, I don't think, but won't be far off.
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| Dullaron |
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Diablo III - Dunard #1884
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Reged: 07/22/05
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Posts: 6125
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Loc: Fort Worth, Tx
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Re: FWIW, MAME slower on Win 11 vs Win 10 on my system.
[Re: Robbbert]
#392637 - 11/19/21 06:56 AM
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> > So as many know for benching I have an i7-6700K on an Asus Sabertooth z170 m.2. I
> > built this in 2016 and overloaded it at the time to futureproof it as far as I
> could.
> > So far it's been doing fine at 4.5Ghz providing bench runs every release.
> >
> > Enter Windows 11.
>
> I have heaps of computers of varying ages, the newest not even a year old - and not
> one of them is suitable for Windows 11. I don't see the point of buying yet another
> computer for an inferior OS, so I'll wait for Windows 12. Perhaps Microsoft might see
> sense and relax the idiotic restrictions. And maybe pigs might fly.
Only problem is that the updates for the 10 will be disabled. Microsoft to end Windows 10 support on October 14th, 2025
Less than 3 years away.
I don't know they gonna shut down the store or not for the 10.
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W11 Home 64-bit + Nobara OS / AMD Radeon RX 5700 XT / AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 8-Core 3.59 GHz / RAM 64 GB
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Re: FWIW, MAME slower on Win 11 vs Win 10 on my system.
[Re: Dullaron]
#392638 - 11/19/21 11:39 AM
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> Only problem is that the updates for the 10 will be disabled. Microsoft to end
> Windows 10 support on October 14th, 2025
>
> Less than 3 years away.
>
> I don't know they gonna shut down the store or not for the 10.
4 years away, not 3.
I never use the store, don't care about it.
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Re: FWIW, MAME slower on Win 11 vs Win 10 on my system.
[Re: Robbbert]
#392643 - 11/20/21 02:52 AM
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Or use Mac OS like me. No silly requirements and lifetime uodates!
If you have a M1 cpu of Apple, and use the M1 MAME build you'll have benchmark results destroying each intel or amd cpu. I'm way over any of John's benchmarks, including the i9 listed.
Only the amd threadripper with 64 cores is faster then an M1 but yeah, it costs equal as the whole Mac laptop...
Just my 2 cents...
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Re: FWIW, MAME slower on Win 11 vs Win 10 on my system.
[Re: flyingpiggy]
#392644 - 11/20/21 04:49 AM
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> Or use Mac OS like me. No silly requirements and lifetime uodates!
You have to buy a Mac (requirement), Mac's from as recent as mid 2015 are not supported by latest version of OSX. By the time Windows 10 goes end of support, OSX will almost certainly require an M1 family CPU.
> If you have a M1 cpu of Apple, and use the M1 MAME build you'll have benchmark
> results destroying each intel or amd cpu. I'm way over any of John's benchmarks,
> including the i9 listed.
The benchmark results for the M1 cpu are impressive, but I've yet to see a complete set of result for the standard suite of games, and many of the most demanding roms have lower scores on the M1. (at least for the benchmarks I can find)
> Only the amd threadripper with 64 cores is faster then an M1 but yeah, it costs equal
> as the whole Mac laptop...
Multicore performance has little effect on MAME, a Threadripper will be slower than a Ryzen 7 5800x in MAME.
Most roms only use one or two cores, with a few scaling up to maybe four, any scaling beyond that is mostly down to the extra cores handling background tasks and freeing up the other cores to run MAME exclusively. This is probably why the M1 does so well in MAME, it has very good single core performance.
I'd be interest to see complete benchmark run for MAME on the M1, I'd also like see how well it runs Dolphin Blue, which is my current performance white whale. I'd be very interest to see how the massive memory bandwidth gains on the M1 Pro & M1 MAX effect performance in MAME.
The big catch with the M1 is your locked into buying Apple, and currently OSX (native Linux still needs a lot of work), and you're locked out of any hardware tweaking. I hope that other manufactures take up the challenge, so we can have an open platform with a performance ARM CPU in the near future.
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If all else fails, Burn the manual.
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> By the time Windows 10 goes end of support, OSX
> will almost certainly require an M1 family CPU.
Given Apple's 2 other switch overs, I concur to this.
> I'd be interest to see complete benchmark run for MAME on the M1, I'd also like see
> how well it runs Dolphin Blue, which is my current performance white whale. I'd be
> very interest to see how the massive memory bandwidth gains on the M1 Pro & M1 MAX
> effect performance in MAME.
Looking to go M1 next year, remind me and I'll do this for you
> The big catch with the M1 is your locked into buying Apple, and currently OSX (native
> Linux still needs a lot of work), and you're locked out of any hardware tweaking.
This again is true. But my home computing is based around it and I will only update my PCs every 5-7 years anyway so I can save up for them. Some people will call it unnessecery cost but IMO everything post Windows 7 has been a series of disappointing trojan horses and I just don't get on with linux... so if I have to pay more to enjoy using my computer and not need to swear at the makers... Eh, so be it.
> You have to buy a Mac (requirement), Mac's from as recent as mid 2015 are not
> supported by latest version of OSX.
Not strictly true, I installed OSX 12 no issues... Altough yeah, probably the last version thet they will release. TBH I don't mind, the damn fans are just rediculous on this thing...
[ATTACHED IMAGE]
Edited by NaokiS (11/21/21 12:22 AM)
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> Just my 2 cents...
Unfortunately, flyingpiggy made a wrong turn and flew into an abattoir, later emerging as a selection of pork rolls, bacon rashers, and ham sandwiches. Plus the obligatory tin of spam.
[ATTACHED IMAGE]
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Re: FWIW, MAME slower on Win 11 vs Win 10 on my system.
[Re: NaokiS]
#392647 - 11/21/21 04:14 AM
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> > You have to buy a Mac (requirement), Mac's from as recent as mid 2015 are not
> > supported by latest version of OSX.
>
> Not strictly true, I installed OSX 12 no issues... Altough yeah, probably the last
> version thet they will release. TBH I don't mind, the damn fans are just rediculous
> on this thing...
I should have said some models from as recent as mid 2015 aren't supported. The iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, Mid 2015) & MacBook (Retina, 12-inch, Early 2015) are not supported by Monterey, it's not all models but it's still makes the point Apple has already dropped support for hardware from around the time Windows 10 was released.
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If all else fails, Burn the manual.
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Re: FWIW, MAME slower on Win 11 vs Win 10 on my system.
[Re: taz-nz]
#392651 - 11/21/21 06:31 PM
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> > > You have to buy a Mac (requirement), Mac's from as recent as mid 2015 are not
> > > supported by latest version of OSX.
> >
> > Not strictly true, I installed OSX 12 no issues... Altough yeah, probably the last
> > version thet they will release. TBH I don't mind, the damn fans are just rediculous
> > on this thing...
>
> I should have said some models from as recent as mid 2015 aren't supported. The iMac
> (Retina 5K, 27-inch, Mid 2015) & MacBook (Retina, 12-inch, Early 2015) are not
> supported by Monterey, it's not all models but it's still makes the point Apple has
> already dropped support for hardware from around the time Windows 10 was released.
Oh yeah I know, wasn't trying to seem pedantic. At the end of the day, they are a business out to make money from its customers altough I suspect M1 will be supported for a while to come yet.
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