| yoeddy |
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Sound perfectionist
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Reged: 12/27/03
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MAME update from 0.177 to 0.205 help
#380457 - 12/31/18 09:37 AM
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Hi guys,
So I’m running 0.177 on an intel I7 core running Vista 64 with MAME 64. Been running solid and I decided to update.
When I try to fire up the new 0.205 MAME64 exe, I get the following:
“The procedure entry point K32EnumProcessModules could not be located in the dynamic link library KERNAL32.dll”
Just crashes to the Windows desktop. Is Vista 64-bit no longer supported?
Thanks,
Jason
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Re: MAME update from 0.177 to 0.205 help
[Re: yoeddy]
#380458 - 12/31/18 10:06 AM
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KERNAL32? Are you running some bizarre Commodore 64/Windows NT hybrid? :P
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| yoeddy |
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Sound perfectionist
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Reged: 12/27/03
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Posts: 239
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Loc: Boise, Idaho
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Re: MAME update from 0.177 to 0.205 help
[Re: Vas Crabb]
#380459 - 12/31/18 10:42 AM
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> KERNAL32? Are you running some bizarre Commodore 64/Windows NT hybrid? :P
Haha! My bad...KERNEL32. Just Vista 64-bit Ultimate.
Jason
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| yoeddy |
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Sound perfectionist
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Reged: 12/27/03
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Posts: 239
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Loc: Boise, Idaho
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Re: MAME update from 0.172 to 0.205 help
[Re: yoeddy]
#380489 - 01/02/19 02:28 AM
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Any ideas on this one guys? I'm actually running 0.172 on my cabinet currently...not 0.177.
Thanks,
Jason
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Re: MAME update from 0.172 to 0.205 help
[Re: yoeddy]
#380490 - 01/02/19 02:39 AM
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> Any ideas on this one guys? I'm actually running 0.172 on my cabinet currently...not
> 0.177.
>
> Thanks,
> Jason
It sounds like a common issue people have run into with Vista, affecting far more than just MAME.
If your Vista is already fully up to date then I don't think there is a solution.
Keep in mind that Vista basically ended up unsupported by Microsoft before even XP.
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Re: MAME update from 0.172 to 0.205 help
[Re: Haze]
#380500 - 01/02/19 02:52 PM
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> It sounds like a common issue people have run into with Vista, affecting far more
> than just MAME.
>
> If your Vista is already fully up to date then I don't think there is a solution.
>
> Keep in mind that Vista basically ended up unsupported by Microsoft before even XP.
Doesn't mean that the rest of the world should suddenly dump support. Microsoft is a for-profit corporation, they could drop support for an operating system a year after it came out if they wanted to just to push people to the latest and (not always) greatest OS for maximum profit. The only reason a Windows 9 doesn't exist is that they wanted to compete with Apple's Mac OS X (pronounced "O S Ten") so the new Microsoft OS became Windows 10 instead. It's the car industry all over again, a new model for the sake of a new model.
Microsoft only dumped Vista because they also had a mess called Windows 8 to clean up, so it was in their best interest to kill XP (because IE6) and Vista (unpopular due to poor performance out of the box on crappy PCs) ASAP so they could push as many people towards Windows 10 before everyone "downgraded" back to 7 or even XP (shock horror). It's a wonder Microsoft didn't drop support for Windows 7 at the same time just to stop that from happening.
Unsurprisingly, MAME 0.205 is working here, even on my XP machines. Of course, with such old systems I had to tweak the default mame.ini settings otherwise it drops back to GDI which does no good to anyone.
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Re: MAME update from 0.172 to 0.205 help
[Re: Heihachi_73]
#380501 - 01/02/19 02:58 PM
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> > It sounds like a common issue people have run into with Vista, affecting far more
> > than just MAME.
> >
> > If your Vista is already fully up to date then I don't think there is a solution.
> >
> > Keep in mind that Vista basically ended up unsupported by Microsoft before even XP.
>
>
> Doesn't mean that the rest of the world should suddenly dump support. Microsoft is a
> for-profit corporation, they could drop support for an operating system a year after
> it came out if they wanted to just to push people to the latest and (not always)
> greatest OS for maximum profit. The only reason a Windows 9 doesn't exist is that
> they wanted to compete with Apple's Mac OS X (pronounced "O S Ten") so the new
> Microsoft OS became Windows 10 instead. It's the car industry all over again, a new
> model for the sake of a new model.
>
> Microsoft only dumped Vista because they also had a mess called Windows 8 to clean
> up, so it was in their best interest to kill XP (because IE6) and Vista (unpopular
> due to poor performance out of the box on crappy PCs) ASAP so they could push as many
> people towards Windows 10 before everyone "downgraded" back to 7 or even XP (shock
> horror). It's a wonder Microsoft didn't drop support for Windows 7 at the same time
> just to stop that from happening.
>
> Unsurprisingly, MAME 0.205 is working here, even on my XP machines. Of course, with
> such old systems I had to tweak the default mame.ini settings otherwise it drops back
> to GDI which does no good to anyone.
Sorry, but if the OS is a buggy piece of crap that doesn't work how it should even when something should be compatible (it does, as you point out, still run on XP) then there is absolutely no reason the rest of the world should continue to support it. Workarounds for broken operating systems, compilers etc. aren't pretty.
Vista had the potential to be good, and arguably by the last service pack it was actually better in some ways to work with than both XP before it and 7 that followed, but by that time the damage was done, the project was, at Microsoft, nothing but a trainwreck, and some things were left in states not really fit for public consumption because the general expectation was that by that point nobody was using it.
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Re: MAME update from 0.172 to 0.205 help
[Re: Haze]
#380502 - 01/02/19 03:20 PM
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> Vista had the potential to be good, and arguably by the last service pack it was
> actually better in some ways to work with than both XP before it and 7 that followed,
> but by that time the damage was done, the project was, at Microsoft, nothing but a
> trainwreck, and some things were left in states not really fit for public consumption
> because the general expectation was that by that point nobody was using it.
Yeah, Vista and 7 aren't that much different, at least when Vista is updated and tweaked to remove the unnecessary background stuff (which is why it was such a slow memory hog in the first place). My E7400 still has Vista and I have no plans on changing it just for the sake of upgrading - it's mainly used for emulation so there isn't any need to upgrade (aside from the emulator itself) unless of course the emulator over time suddenly refuses to run on such systems. When MAME drops Vista/7 I will probably just move to Linux if I have to upgrade MAME itself, although that could be detrimental for the Windows-only games if they decide not to work in Wine or the like.
I still think Firefox only dropped Vista for the sake of not being the odd one out, it had almost nothing to do with security (unlike XP) but just a case of keeping up with the Kardashians otherwise known as Google and Microsoft.
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Re: MAME update from 0.172 to 0.205 help
[Re: Heihachi_73]
#380505 - 01/02/19 04:48 PM
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> Doesn't mean that the rest of the world should suddenly dump support. Microsoft is a
> for-profit corporation, they could drop support for an operating system a year after
> it came out if they wanted to just to push people to the latest and (not always)
> greatest OS for maximum profit.
Fact is, Vista is unpopular with developers. None of MAMEdev are going to test on Vista because Win7 is like vista without most of the annoyances. There's no incentive for developers to test on an unsupported OS that they don't use themselves. You keep forgetting that no-one's paying for MAME to support these operating systems, and even if they were there'd have to be a significant number of paying customers on Vista to make it worth the extra development/testing/support work.
> The only reason a Windows 9 doesn't exist is that
> they wanted to compete with Apple's Mac OS X (pronounced "O S Ten") so the new
> Microsoft OS became Windows 10 instead. It's the car industry all over again, a new
> model for the sake of a new model.
Nope, the reason for skipping 9 is shitloads of software that checks to see if the version string starts with "9" to run in Win9x mode (as opposed to WinNT mode) rather than doing it the proper way. It worked for "95" and "98" so developers assumed it would work forever.
> Microsoft only dumped Vista because they also had a mess called Windows 8 to clean
> up, so it was in their best interest to kill XP (because IE6) and Vista (unpopular
> due to poor performance out of the box on crappy PCs) ASAP so they could push as many
> people towards Windows 10 before everyone "downgraded" back to 7 or even XP (shock
> horror). It's a wonder Microsoft didn't drop support for Windows 7 at the same time
> just to stop that from happening.
It was just a rational decision. Microsoft's biggest paying customers are businesses. A lot of businesses skipped Vista entirely, going straight from XP to 7. They dropped the product that was unprofitable to support.
> Unsurprisingly, MAME 0.205 is working here, even on my XP machines. Of course, with
> such old systems I had to tweak the default mame.ini settings otherwise it drops back
> to GDI which does no good to anyone.
I'm really not going to make any effort to support Windows XP/Server 2003/Vista if it gets in the way of useful functionality. It's no longer worth it when most of the world has moved on.
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Re: MAME update from 0.172 to 0.205 help
[Re: Vas Crabb]
#380508 - 01/02/19 05:06 PM
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> It was just a rational decision. Microsoft's biggest paying customers are businesses.
> A lot of businesses skipped Vista entirely, going straight from XP to 7. They dropped
> the product that was unprofitable to support.
>
> > Unsurprisingly, MAME 0.205 is working here, even on my XP machines. Of course, with
> > such old systems I had to tweak the default mame.ini settings otherwise it drops
> back
> > to GDI which does no good to anyone.
>
There were actually a fair few that upgraded, I think it's another thing that contributed towards it being hated at the time.
Vista had a bug where the desktop clock would just stop updating, it would be stuck at a time forever until you killed task manager and restarted. This wasn't even an infrequent bug, it happened often.
I was working in an office for a while where every machine was on Vista, and *without fail* at least once a day somebody would be furious that they'd missed their lunch break because the clock on the PC had frozen, and they'd been using that for timekeeping. Got to the point where everybody was just setting lunch break alarms on their phones instead. I think it was eventually fixed, but by that time everybody had abandoned the OS anyway.
Causing staff to miss lunch breaks was a surefire way to get your OS to be hated.
(Win 10 is hated by staff for the new solitaire etc. which is 100x less discrete than the old ones and generates network traffic due to the advertising; I'm sure employers like it, but employees sure don't, although the fact that those games always got left in workplace installs anyway suggests maybe some management see they had value in terms of stress relief / staff morale)
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Re: MAME update from 0.172 to 0.205 help
[Re: Haze]
#380509 - 01/02/19 10:13 PM
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My employer just updated all our computers to Win10 a few weeks ago. We don't have any games on it. I feel cheated
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Windows 11 64 bit OS
Intel Core i7-10700
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32GB DDR4 RAM
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I've been here before
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Reged: 01/16/15
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Posts: 130
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Re: MAME update from 0.172 to 0.205 help
[Re: Heihachi_73]
#380535 - 01/03/19 03:34 PM
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> I still think Firefox only dropped Vista for the sake of not being the odd one out,
> it had almost nothing to do with security (unlike XP) but just a case of keeping up
> with the Kardashians otherwise known as Google and Microsoft.
Time is money, not supporting vista saves them time.
While Google and Microsoft supported it then they will have felt obligated, to try to maintain as much market share as possible.
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Re: MAME update from 0.172 to 0.205 help
[Re: Heihachi_73]
#380638 - 01/10/19 10:43 AM
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You want a good reason to go Win7 instead of Vista?
WDDM 1.1, which removes a bottleneck that can cause any graphics app to freeze desktop/app rendering in a similar (yet far worse!) fashion to Windows XP.
Windows 7 isn't "just" a slightly-improved Vista, there are some very important fixes in the back end of the OS.
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Try checking the MAME manual at http://docs.mamedev.org
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